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I’m being called out in the comments for being a Sellaband slacker. It’s interesting, I’ve been on lots of musician services and social networks but I’ve never been ragged on for not hassling everyone more to listen to my junk. What’s up with that?

My impression is basically you need to spam the shit out of everyone to get anywhere on Sellaband. I really hate doing that sort of stuff. But if I was going to resort to brute-force hassling I might as well do it on my terms, with the proceeds going directly to me on a website permanently in my control.

Also as much of a capitalist I am, the phrase “maximize your believer potential” kinda turns my stomach.

Posted on - June 4, 2007 [at] 3:32 pm by Brad
Tagged in -

16 Comments on this post

Jefff on Sellaband
June 4, 2007 at 4:49 pm

Wow, those comments make me want to throw up all over Sellaband.

scottandrew on Sellaband
June 4, 2007 at 5:54 pm

That one guy is kinda being a jerk about it.

I really don’t understand the point of Sellaband, except that maybe it’s good for the artists who [can’t|don’t want to] mess around with fundraising widgets on their own websites.

kenflagg on Sellaband
June 4, 2007 at 8:27 pm

Yeah, the SheetMetal guy is giving you a guilt trip for not being active amongst the community of your fans – on Sellaband’s website! He sounds like a shill. They’re trying to build a demographic base to market to is all. You just happen to already have a really active website already; you could probably raise 50k here.

Marco Raaphorst on Sellaband
June 7, 2007 at 7:23 am

Brad, are you aware of the copyright Sellaband is using? You will loose the rights to the songs on Sellaband for ever. Even if you quit Sellaband. Might be good for some, but it’s a total opposite of what’s CC is all about in my opinion.

Brad on Sellaband
June 7, 2007 at 7:50 am

Marco: where’s that at? All I remember reading is that any songs you record with the $50k are their property for a year.

JohanV on Sellaband
June 7, 2007 at 2:19 pm

Hi Brad,

I’m one of the guys behind SellaBand and want to chime in here for a sec. If SellaBand is not for you then that is fine and we will totally respect that. You can leave at any point before you reach 50K and you don’t owe us anything. What Mr. Raaphorst is saying is that we would own the rights of your songs if you would leave us is probably the most ridiculous thing I’ve ever heard. So, not to worry, you’re more than happy to stay with us, or you can leave on your own terms. It’s your music, it’s your choice.
Take care,

Marco Raaphorst on Sellaband
June 8, 2007 at 3:49 am

there’s a Dutch document:

It seems that the songs you put on the site are no longer under your control, they are under the control of Sellaband.

“3.1 The Conditions shall remain in full force and effect while the Artist participates in the SellaBand program, in accordance with the Conditions and the Agreements. However, termination of the participation of the Artist will leave the licensing or transfer of rights to SellaBand unaffected. Besides, conditions which should survive termination of the participation of the Artist on the basis of their nature, shall remain in full force and effect.”

And more. Does it suck? Yes, very much.

John B. Baloumba on Sellaband
June 8, 2007 at 6:20 am

Hi everyone,

On the other hand, as a Believer, If someone take the time to read all the legal things, contracts and so on, you may discover this is really a very fair way for us to give some money to young or absolute beginner’s band the chance/luck/opportunity to get some exposure and even perhaps have their first album recorded.

As a Member since the very beginning, nothing to complain about and very happy of the new developements… Impatient of the launch of the first album produced by Believers.

We Are All Believers…

Take Care


JohanV on Sellaband
June 8, 2007 at 3:31 pm

Read the words right, Mr. Raaphorst, and that’s also what MMFN should have done. If you leave the program it leaves the rights unaffected, meaning that no transfer of rights from the artist to SellaBand has been put into effect.
I don’t mind criticism but you’ve got to get the facts right. And in this particular case I can tell you that during our first 10 months of existence, about 4000 bands have signed up, some 20 or so have decided to leave (or disbanded) before reaching 50K and no rights have been transferred, nor will they ever hear from us again.
Situation clarified, I hope…

Marco Raaphorst on Sellaband
June 9, 2007 at 1:49 am

@Johan: I think I’ve done this. If you can leave Sellaband and keep your rights: great. Even better if you could keep them all the time. Still, this contract is old style to me and has not much to do with ‘sharing economy’ and open content. It can work for bands, sure, but it’s restrictive for many others. A matter of choice of course.

Sheet Metal on Sellaband
July 3, 2007 at 7:15 am

Just want to reply to some of the comments here.

When I saw Brad Sucks on SAB I was really excited. I loved the music, and I thought – Here we go, this guy has the whole package. If you see my previous comments, I stated that Brad definitely does NOT suck.

The thing is that SAB is a community. You need to have a bit of a presence to get some exposure as there are 4,000 plus artists on there now. Spamming happens, but is not an effective promotional tool, with inter-profile networking being the best option alongside the posts in the forums.

Negative comments? I don’t think I made one negative comment *about* Brad Sucks. I reacted to this post, by a user who has only posted once, and only has one part – In Brad Sucks

“User: Padraic
If you want to see “activity”, just go to his website, which is much better than anything SellaBand can provide.”

Nice first (and only) post Padraic. To which I responded;

“that attitude “sucks”. Shame, as he is a great artist and the benefits far outweigh what he can do on his blog over there!”

OK, maybe a little bit childish in a Tit-for-Tat fashion, but in my opinion, the shill here is Padraic, who has posted ONE negative comment in our community, directing people to the Brad Sucks website.

**A shill, for people who don’t know is a person planted in an audience, historically employed by travelling carnivals and medicine men. The shill would be “magically” restored by whatever snakeoil the presenter was selling, thus giving the potential customers (or rubes) the confidence to buy the product.

No, I’m not a shill by any means. For a start I think I would need to have a far larger amount of belief to be convincing. I’ve just been having some very positive experiences on the site.

If Brad Sucks can raise $50,000 over here then good luck – really! I hope that it happens, as I really like the music, and he’ won’t need anywhere near that amount of money to create a great album. But anyone who thinks this is just about raising $50k is being very short sighted. This is a great place to get our music heard by many like minded people and forge strong links between artists.

Thanks for reading. I’m sorry if I offended with any of my comments, but I was just trying to engender some activity in an artist I thought would gain some following from our community and also add to the vibrant pallett of existing artists there.

Best wishes,

Dreb of Sheet Metal

Utterly B Groovy on Sellaband
July 3, 2007 at 8:08 am

Just listening to “Brad Sucks” on Sellaband and I like it a lot!
Shame about all the shouting and carrying on though.

BFG on Sellaband
July 13, 2007 at 4:11 am

Has a anyone tried I read their terms and conditions and they don’t take any of the publishing rights, the music is all yours. They ask for £2 for the sale of every album for a period of 2 years after that you can keep it all.

Spamming would be a waste of time as the initial phase of the financing process is anonymous, your music has do do all the speaking for you :)

Rudi on Sellaband
July 28, 2007 at 3:39 am

I haven’t tried Slicethepie, because I can’t sing ;-). But I did check them out, and this is how they work :

Step 1 : Bands have to put songs up (don’t forget : costs money to the band ! (20 £)). Scouts (can be you, me, your brother, sister, neighbour, best friend, most hated acquintance [ this last one was a joke] , …. ) review the songs : they just simply hear the song, without being informed who the band/artist is. They have to write a review to the song, and give a grade to the song (e.g. 9/10, 3/10, 0/10).
As the sites says it themselves : ” 1. Scout Room
Up to 1,000 artists enter a Scout Room where music fans give you high quality feedback on your 3 demo tracks. ”

Ehm, just don’t expect too much “high quality” in those feedbacks.
To give you a small idea about those “quality feedbacks” :

Step 2 : Up to 20 artists with the best review score go to the next stage. So if you’re band number 21 out of thousand in review score or even lower, you’re already out. The good news is you can pay (I mean enter) again for step 1.
They say it themselves : ” Up to 20 artists with the best reviews from the Scout Room are then featured in the Showcase. ”

Step 3 : They call this step “Get Financed”. So you’ve made it through step 1 and 2. Now your fans will be able to buy ‘Backstage Passes’ which entitles them the right on your album when it’s finished. Backstage Passes are priced 10 £ in the FAQ-section, but they are actual 15 £.
They say it this way : ” All artists who get enough support in the Showcase will receive £15,000 to record an album. Whatever happens, the most popular artist is guaranteed £15,000 ”

They say “the most popular artist is guaranteed £ 15.000″

Unfortunately this guarantee is just a statement, see this in their Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ) : ” What if an artist raises only £13,000, for example?
Sorry, artists must raise a minimum of £15,000 through the sale of Backstage Passes as we believe that this is about the minimum required to record, release and market a professional album. The £13,000 raised is returned to the Backstage Pass holders.

So you could pass Step 1 and 2, which is already quite an effort and still end up with nothing.

And if you’ve passed all 3 steps, and raised all the money from the fans, you will get 15,000 £ and have to go recording a minimum 8-track album (there is only ‘The Guide’ to help you, but you will only know what this ‘The Guide’ means when you’ve raised the 15 K £. Your fans will be entitled on ONE DOWNLOAD of your album for each 15 £ invested.

There’s also the possibility to skip steps 1 and 2 by proving to Slicethepie to have 5,000 genuine fans and their emailadresses (Myspace friends don’t count as genuine fans). This way you go directly to the step where the 15,000 £ still has to be raised.

” What if an artist raises only £13,000, for example?
Sorry, artists must raise a minimum of £15,000 through the sale of Backstage Passes as we believe that this is about the minimum required to record, release and market a professional album. The £13,000 raised is returned to the Backstage Pass holders ” copied from Slicethepie FAQ – Backstage Passes (Finance) – What if an artist raises only £13,000, for example?

” What is the process?
First contact us on with evidence of your existing fan base and some information about you/ the band, we will then let you know whether you can use Slicethepie to raise finance. Remember, there is no point in pretending you have enough fans as unless you raise a minimum of £15,000 you will not receive anything and may look a bit silly for having tried. If we agree to help, you will then send an email to all your fans (we will provide the content) telling them how to help you by financing your album. This e-mail will direct them to your financing page on Slicethepie where they can buy Backstage Passes. ” Info copied from Slicethepie FAQ Direct Financing – What is the process ?

Rudi on Sellaband
July 28, 2007 at 3:49 am

Forgot to mention :

Everyone can sign up as a ‘Scout’ on Slicethepie. At no charge. You can even earn money as a ‘Scout’ be writing reviews for the songs you hear. You won’t know which artist or band it is, since it will be anonymous. For each review you will receive money on your Slicethepie account. The amount depends on your star-rating. If you’re a 5-star-scout you’ll earn 25 pence/review. If you’re a 1-star-scout you’ll earn 10 pence/review.

You can even have your earnings payed out with Paypal.

JC on Sellaband
August 25, 2007 at 5:05 am

Just thought i would add in that most the current arena are free to enter and that the backstage passes are 10 £ for the artist that make it through the showcase. The forst 3 bands that were financed had it at 15 £ so that they could quickly raise the money. but from now on im aware that it will be 10 £.

i also thought i would add that in the scouting process the tracks are submitted to you randomly and played to you (you have full control of playing the track again, pausing it, etc.) once played you rate it out of 10 then are required to submit a review. this review is recommended to be at least a few sentances long to benefit the artist and to also benefit your scout rating.

with your earning from the scouting process (being a scout) you can purchase items on the site eg. the backstage pass, contracts (in the exchange) or like rudi said tranfer with paypal. you can even use the money to enter an arena so you dont lose money!!

there is probably alot that both me and rudi have missed out on so you better go check it out yourself! :)

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